Conversation with...
Pausha Foley, MS Psychology, University of Silesia in Katowice
Me: Experience what?
Pausha: Experience awareness without having any sense of oneself as a person who is being aware. Experience no longer being Pausha, a human, a woman - but being awareness. Only awareness.
Me: I call that Zen [experience, the offspring of Subject and Object].
Pausha: I am not sure about subject and object in experience. That is how the human mind experiences. That is not the only way to experience. When the mind get’s left behind, so does the object and the subject.
Me: Without the object, music, no listening experience can take place. Without a subject in the room to hear it, no listening experience can take place. It requires both. Once experience is conditioned, the subject can choose to identify with the experience instead of identifying with the experiencer. It’s a case of mistaken identity..
Pausha: Experiencing being that which one hears changes one’s perspective on object/subject separation somewhat. Take, for example, a human who observes a floor he sits on, then becomes the floor as well as the human that sits on the floor. Is the human mistaken in identifying himself as the floor while he is being the floor? Or is the human mistaken in identifying himself as a human? Or is the human mistaken in identifying himself with one, separate and distinct object while he is, in fact, all objects and the space beyond objects?
Me: I would say both are true. You are not what you identify with. You are simply the one with the ability to identify.
Pausha: If I have the ability to identify with anything then I am anything. Then I am the subject as well as the object.
Me: I guess you could look at it that way. Is it self-deception, though? If I identify as you, for example, I have no control over that form, only my own.
Pausha: It is self-deception as long as it is what you think. When it is what you actually experience, what you are - that is a different story.
Me: Knowing a floor has no sense organs or brain to process any environmental stimuli, what is it like to be a floor experientially?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5j_ps7ylddE
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